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Web Site => Web Site Updates, Suggestions, and Support => Topic started by: Reno on February 21, 2010, 12:08:35 PM



Title: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 21, 2010, 12:08:35 PM
[Admin Edit Start]
This thread is the continuation of the List of all Drum Setups? Is it needed?? (http://www.drumsoloartist.com/live/drumforum/index.php/topic,590.0.html) Thread
[Admin Edit End]


Curiosity got the best of me after my previous post, and off I went in search of useful code snips..  I have found something in the GPL category which can serve as a platform for a first-generation setup engine, so I'll see what I can do with it.

This idea will not be a full-blown app, rather than save data it will simply provide draggable images on the screen which can be arranged to resemble a drum kit layout. From there, simply use "print screen" button on keyboard to copy the result to clipboard, and paste into ms paint or similar for final cropping and saving. Then just upload as a regular image.

If I read this script right, it should be able to use a single resizable image to proportionally display any size of tom and another for any size cymbal, and does not use any SQL so overall it should be very lightweight in terms of bandwidth/server overhead.

We'll see how it goes...


Title: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on February 21, 2010, 01:32:54 PM
Very interesting! - Keep us in touch, and thanks a lot for trying to dig it out!


Title: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 21, 2010, 07:30:51 PM
sample:
(dead link, removed)

(this link is for feasibility testing only, the intent is for the script to be moved to dsa servers when complete)


Title: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on February 21, 2010, 08:02:04 PM
WOW!!! - It looks VERY promising!!

Using javascript is exactly the way I wanted it to be done! - Fundamentally I think it is very close to be ready, although it is only my opinion...

Some thoughts:

What about :

Resizing drums by dragging the corners of the image on stage??
Rotating images on stage?

Saving user drum setup?
Recalling user Drum setup?
Multiple drum setups per user?

What do you think??


Title: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 21, 2010, 08:19:19 PM
all of the above.. lol   as it is, the script driving it can be made to give resize tabs on the images (as well as allow fluid resizing with shift+drag - i just plugged that feature into the bass drum images).

rotation ability is also possible (and needed for things like kicks and anything else un-round), although I will have to code that feature in.

For saving, the script does in fact keep track of the xyz of each image which can be returned in a form making it possible to save and re-display from the saved data. And of course if you can save one layout it's a minor trick to save multiple ones.

This sample was probably the easiest part (as evidenced by how long it took, which was an afternoon).. the rest will be far more time consuming, the final product will probably be a combination of d/xhtml, AJAX, and PERL.


Title: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 21, 2010, 08:24:10 PM
but then I might just start over using vector drawing rather than dragging pre-made images.. so far this is just at the 'explore the possibilities' stage, it kinda works but it needs a LOT of tweaking.


Title: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on February 21, 2010, 08:31:37 PM
Resizing works great! (in my opinion)... And I forgot... I dont know pearl, but can do a few basic things in PHP and of course can help with images, css html... So if you need any help, just mention it and you got it ;)


Title: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: KenSanders on February 21, 2010, 08:59:06 PM
I'm anxious to see the results of your work (both of you).  Sounds pretty cool.


Title: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Tomm on February 22, 2010, 09:40:34 AM
This sounds great.  Thanks for all the work, fer sure.


Title: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 22, 2010, 11:10:48 PM
(we almost need a dev thread for this..)

Updated and cleaned up a bit (a lot? lol  the last one was functional but really ugly/cumbersome).

Lots of missing images and things that just don't work (yet) but it shows good direction. From here it can be tweaked for better control of the z-index, and with some additional scripting it will generate the numbered item list (and number the corresponding objects on the stage) on the fly using description.

Rotating objects:  This will not be easy. I think the only real option here is to make multiple images for each rotatable part (like kick drums).. if we allow 2 degree increments, we will need about 45 images per object. This new sample lists a bunch of different sizes for kicks, there are no images yet for any of them because I have not decided the best way to go.. resize ability is the easiest, but produces poor resolution when the image is sized too far from it's native size.

but hey it's only day two, I'm not gonna sweat the small stuff yet.. ;)


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on February 23, 2010, 01:01:32 AM
It does look seriously cleaned up! - And the form idea where you choose the drum size is great too!

And I thought rotating would not be such a pain... I mean if it will require 40+ images per object maybe it is not a bad idea to have (less resolution?) - 5 degree increments?? This will significantly cut the amount of needed images?

PS: I am not concerned about the quantity, but rather throwing thoughts in the air in order to make the job easier... I mean, in my opinion, a 2 degree increments is a pretty high resolution for any real-life drum setup. - Is there a drummer that would REALLY require such a high precision of his setup?

In any case - This already looks like it is about to become the best Drum Setup Application I have ever used!


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 23, 2010, 01:37:04 AM
It's a lot faster now too..  the first version loaded every image (all sizes of each object) and then made copies of each (to allow for say a hat and crash of the same size, or a 14" snare and a 14" tom). It made for higher than needed bandwidth, plus the client side cpu/memory demand was way higher than it had to be.

In this version, the only images loaded to start with (other than the throne) are the button icons. Everything else is loaded on the fly, selecting a size tells it which image to call up and plug into the drag/drop api. An unexpected benefit of this is that it is possible to change the scale factor. Default is 5:1 (pixels/inch) which is fine for a monster kit, but a nice tidy jazz kit would look lost on the stage. Providing a way to change the scale to 6:1 or 7, 8, 9, even 10:1 will make smaller kits take up more of the stage area.

Further work on this app will involve the list and data structures, ideally it should be able to produce a savable string of data that can be used to reproduce the layout on demand.
Data required for each item:
x,y coords, z-index, width, height, image set, number, and description text. I'll probably use flat-file at first, porting it to sql (and providing authentication) will be the final stage after a more or less working app is relocated to the dsa domain to get at the user cookie.

Image libraries can be added later as they are cosmetic (a beefed up version can allow the selection of skins ie coated snares, ebony or clear or hydraulic on toms, etc.. )


The prob with rotation is that browsers do not provide a native way of doing it. All experiments in this area involve creating thousands of DIVs per image, clipped in a way where only the required pixel shows in each DIV - these can then be plotted and redrawn, in effect rotating the image. horribly inefficient, even a big gaming system would lag while rotating - multiple images are by far the lesser of two evils in this respect.

The degree of rotation (2 vs 5) will really only be important when laying out the pedals.. a bad angle can make the thing look difficult to play. The kick drum(s) will be mostly buried under other drums, an odd angle there will not stand out too much in what is, after all, just a diagram.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 23, 2010, 05:58:45 PM
v0.3a

- description part now working somewhat for drums and cymbals. It puts in a basic default description if you leave the box blank, otherwise it uses the one you supply.

- images are now numbered as you add them, description list uses same numbers.

- there some layout glitches, things not centered properly.. minor.

This thing is coming together easier than I expected, but it will also be bigger than I expected. Half-baked isn't going to fly with this thing, it will be pretty much full-featured and really slick when all is said and done.

[edited to add Kick/pedal/other components still empty, I'm doing dev with cymbals and shells for now to get the back end ops working. The other buttons will use the same script calls, so turning them on will be just a matter of adding images and tweaking a few lines.]


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on February 23, 2010, 07:04:39 PM
Looks Great!

Few suggestions just in case you have dont know about them already.

1 - Movable description field is Amazing! Although, by default, I would place it underneath the stage and would make it as width as the stage.

That would add some more space for longer descriptions while it would still print the medium descriptions "one per line".

2 - When you dont use the description field in the Add to Stage form, adding an 11" drum prints:

[Number] - 11" Drum

But when you do use the description field in the Add to Stage form, adding an 11" drum prints:

[Number] - [Description]

I think it would be more logical for the application to print Size followed by Description:

[Number] - 11" [Description]

3 - Description Field should adjust its hight if there is no more space to house all added components.
Currently the text just goes over the bottom edge.

4 - Drums, just like Bass Drums should have both Width and Depth sizes.

That is all, although I did not find an ability to remove a drum from stage...

Cheers



Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 23, 2010, 07:38:18 PM
1 - Movable and resizable (shift/drag) is what I am aiming for there... Maybe an option to have more than one column too..  Another design change will be to move the button bar onto the border around the stage, the form can hang over the stage when adding (and give the form a "hide" button). Then move the stage to the left, leaving way more room for the description list on the right.

2 - using both should be an option for sure, I actually didn't think of that (I just wanted it to put something in so I didn't have to every time I tested it.. lol).  Good call.

3 - per 1

4 - that's on the go right now, I should have something interesting to upload later tonight.
... and the delete function is next... lol   that is a must have for sure.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: KenSanders on February 23, 2010, 08:31:28 PM
I'm following with great interest and excitement.  This sounds like a very cool app.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 23, 2010, 11:43:33 PM
Check it out, Ken..

v0.3.1.a is up:

- drums allow depth value
- drums and cymbals have "type" selection
- description box is resizable, shift+drag
- menu moved
- cancel button added to close hardware options


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 24, 2010, 12:05:46 AM
quick note - describe box needs a lock button to pin it down so that you don't need a wheel mouse to scroll it when it overflows..


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on February 24, 2010, 02:20:14 AM
Ken what do you think the drum/cymbal sizes do we need to have currently the form allows 4-22"

In my opinion 4 is unnecessary, as the smallest drum I could think about is 6"...

Same with 22 - in my opinion it is not enough as some orchestral drums go well beyond 36"

Same with cymbals...
There are some really small cymbals out there - is 4" the smallest that you have seen?

And cymbals go way beyond 22" - think Gongs!!

http://www.drumsoloartist.com/Site/Cymbal_Setup.html

Some of them go beyond 60"!

Also do you think we really need the "Drum Types" drop down?? - I mean description could be used for specifying the type.

The reason I dont think that Drum Type OR Cymbal Type is needed cause there are so many drum/cymbal types that if we would include Most of them the scroll-down would be huge!

For example if we include roto tom, bongo and timbale why dont we include:

Cajon
Conga
Darbuka
Djembe
Doumbek
Electronic
Octoban
Xylophone

to name a few...


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 24, 2010, 09:36:24 AM
really good points, Pasha. Currently, the max and min size is determined by available images. As the script evolves it will be able to auto-resize images (always keeping them to scale), which in turn will broaden the size range (to a limited point - we don't want to stretch an image too much, it gets blurry).

Gongs and such will be handled different from other cymbals since they hang vertical rather than balance flat - a disk image wouldn't really be the right thing to use in the context of a typical drum kit. Same with square-ish items like the xylophone and glockenspiel.. But in the case of gongs round images might be just the thing, as per your linked example.

The "type" selection will be made optional like the description, and of course there will be a way to edit the info in the list after the item has been placed. The type and description are considered part of the same string, with type being there more for convenience than anything else.

This part is really just the editor for setups, when the data format is nailed down we will also want a "reader" that can redisplay saved layouts.

[edited to clarify a point.]


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: KenSanders on February 24, 2010, 11:54:48 AM

THIS IS MY REPLY

Ken what do you think the drum/cymbal sizes do we need to have currently the form allows 4-22"

In my opinion 4 is unnecessary, as the smallest drum I could think about is 6"...AGREE

Same with 22 - in my opinion it is not enough as some orchestral drums go well beyond 36" (Some of this could be ihandeled n the text description)
Seems that Tympani and Gong Drums would be the most common "top view" problems..  You could select four or five circles to represent the various sizes that could be detailed in the text.

Same with cymbals...
There are some really small cymbals out there - is 4" the smallest that you have seen?

And cymbals go way beyond 22" - think Gongs!! (Seems like gongs could be "top view" items with the diameter detailed in the text descrition)

Seems like drum brand, or models could also be handled in the text description.





Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: KenSanders on February 24, 2010, 11:56:38 AM
I agree with the points in Reno's last post.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 25, 2010, 10:14:25 PM
there are a few non-existent sizes in the list.. lol I don't think there are 7's or 9's either, or 17's..
we will want some better images at some point, maybe even custom sets (like a set of cymbals with "Zildjian" on them or black skins and chrome rings) in addition to the default set. could be pretty cool.

But you are both right, drums come in certain sizes and 4" isn't one of them.. lol this is why this thread is good, feedback is evil on the stage but in this kind of project it's how details like this don't get overlooked or simply forgotten about while I'm focusing on the scripting..



Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Tomm on February 27, 2010, 09:35:40 PM
Hi tech mentors.  That's what ya are.  Just let me know when I'm supposed to understand what you guys are talking about...Tomm


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 28, 2010, 10:13:51 AM
latest update is almost entirely internal - it now stores and retrieves data on each added item in a way that can be written to a file or database. Having selectively accessible data is also the first step in being able to edit descriptions and such.

Not a very exciting update to look at, but it is progress.. lol  the two data areas are there for testing/debugging, they will be hidden in the final release.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on February 28, 2010, 12:03:12 PM
Appears to work as expected...:)


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 28, 2010, 06:15:23 PM
added editing capability to item list.. as seen on the data button, changes are stored within the javascript database and as such are available to whatever save method we use.

the contents of the js db can be used by a reader to reproduce the layout on demand. Not shown (but existing) are 'kit name' and 'kit owner' fields, which make it possible for members with more than one kit (like Ken) to save multiple setups.

Fine positioning controls added, along with toggling the list on and off to keep it from hiding the editor. Closing editor restores the visibility of the item list.

z-index manipulation working. Next is delete function. done.



[I'll just edit this post with updates related to this version to cut back on the mail spam since I am currently making frequent changes to just about everything.]


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 28, 2010, 08:41:23 PM
Rotation revisited:

I don't know what I was thinking before, I'll just use php/imageMagik to rotate images. The logistic nightmares mentioned earlier only apply to javascript methods.  This is what happens when I micro-analyze things, the obvious can get missed... lol
(dsa servers have that toy installed I hope.. ?)


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on February 28, 2010, 09:06:58 PM
I dont remember... How do I check it? But we will add it if it is needed and not installed...

Cheers.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on February 28, 2010, 10:44:36 PM
make a page called info.php or something, and stick this in it:

Code:
<?php 
  phpinfo
();
?>

if it's installed, it should be listed there somewhere..


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on February 28, 2010, 11:10:18 PM
Running the test above, - it does not appear to be installed, but it is not a problem, I will get it installed when we will need it.

Cheers.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 01, 2010, 02:06:36 AM
 Only things left to add to edit capability are series (only needed if we make additional image packs)  and a control to shift the number around on the image it belongs to.
Should probably have a way to change the number color..

Anyway, that's enough progress to call it a minor revision, v0.3.2 is up.


[edited to add that I seem to have broken it in FF, got to track that bug down. Drums not adding. -fixed... kinda. Still buggy after deleting. I'll fix later, gone for the night.]


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: KenSanders on March 01, 2010, 11:37:02 AM
You guys rock!


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 01, 2010, 06:36:57 PM
man this is driving me crazy... delete and renumbering is a pain with this api, so I'm deleting the delete button... lol

As a work-around, when this thing saves it will simply ignore anything with the status set to h (hidden).

So I'm going to call this portion of the editor complete, and move on to the rotational aspects so that I can get pedals and kick drums happening. I'll have to install imagick on my own server as well to code and test this part, so far it's all JS and DHTML but i guess it's time to add in some php..


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 01, 2010, 06:55:26 PM
how about gd, does the dsa server have that library installed?  that one also does what we need..

[edit - I think I'll learn that stuff later and just use multiple images for now.. it'll still be slick]


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: KenSanders on March 01, 2010, 07:16:41 PM
Once again, I certainly appreciate all of the effort you guys are putting into this application.  I have no doubt, the DSA readers will find it a popular
feature.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 01, 2010, 07:59:56 PM
thanks Ken! I'm getting quite excited about the thing tbh, it's the kind of thing that can continue to evolve long after it's put to use.


working on the kicks right now, and also changing the image set from .gif (lame) to .png format. better scalability and cleaner edges with png.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 02, 2010, 07:17:34 PM
still working on kicks and pics.. cyms and drums now have higher quality png images which work well in Firefox but not in older IE which has no alpha channel support.

Old IE gets gif images now, which have ragged edges (the ones I have used so far), png is nice and smooth.. But I cannot test it in IE7 because IE7 will not run on my old OS (I have 2k, and no intention to change to vista)...  So if someone could test it for me on IE7 that would be grand. (hope to have kicks working sometime tonight or tomorrow)


[edit to add]
The buttons to re-order the list work fine, but so far they do not change the number on the related item on the stage. That obviously has to be fixed lol


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: KenSanders on March 02, 2010, 07:39:29 PM
Super cool ;)


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 03, 2010, 12:23:15 AM
cyms and drums now have higher quality png images which work well in Firefox but not in older IE which has no alpha channel support.

So if someone could test it for me on IE7 that would be grand.

Ok here we go:

WINDOWS:
OS XP Pro SP2


IE 8 (both compatibility mode and regular) - images are .gif

It works overall, but there is no way to set what is in front and what is in the back. - It looks like images are layered one beneath the other in order they were added.

Fire Fox - images are .png - Works well.

Opera - images are .png - Works well.

Safari images are .png - Works Perfect

Mac OS 10.5.8 (Power Mac G5) and 10.6.2 (Intel) - All browsers work identically on both machines.

Safari images are .png - Works Perfect

Fire Fox - images are .png - Works well.

Opera - images are .png - Works well.

There are some weird screen inconsistencies that I have saw on Fire Fox and Opera (images are attached below), but other than this it was ok...

Also on all browsers (mac and pc) even if the throne image was .png the below data info still showed as .gif image.

Thats all for now...


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 03, 2010, 12:57:48 AM
outstanding reply.
I'll fix the sizing issues, that shouldn't be too hard to track down.. I must not have set the cell sizes properly enough to please uber-compliant opera. I like what mac does with the buttons, they look good rounded.

Good eye picking out the throne name error, that was hard coded (that part is from the original sample).

Interesting about the IE prob with the z-index not working. I hate IE, I would love to see designers stop jumping through hoops to satisfy it's childish refusal to be standards-compliant, but I doubt it will ever happen...  i'll track it down and fix it. lol  They shouldn't be gif in IE8 though, I thought I had it set for 5 & 6 only. My bad.

The scroll bars should only be there when the list is sized small enough to require them, overflow is set to auto. The last pic looks like a size issue again, text is shifted to the right so Dn looks like Dr


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 03, 2010, 11:35:13 AM
Reno, I made a mistake in my previous report!

I revisited all the browsers and found out that in IE 8 It is possible to set what is in front and what is in the back from both the editor and by clicking on the items on stage. - The problem is the throne! - It is always on top of everything no matter what you click.

Other than this my report was accurate.

I am very sorry for the confusion :-[


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 03, 2010, 07:29:24 PM
I've noticed that about the throne, I'll change the way it's added to the stage to fix that issue.  I'm actually not very concerned about it since it is unlikely anything would ever be over it other than the drummer's butt  lol  but still it's something that isn't working as it should and therefore needs to be fixed. Thanks for rechecking and clarifying the IE8 issue, I was at a loss to understand why it didn't respect the z-index calls.

I have the browser detection for IE fixed in my local work copy, I'll upload it later tonight - IE7 and 8 should both use the much higher resolution png images after that. The incorrect reporting of the throne image is also fixed in this build.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 04, 2010, 09:36:57 AM
- kicks use a single image currently, no matter which size you declare..  I'll work on that.
- .png should now work in IE7 & 8
- changed doctype declaration from xml to html, alignment in the editor should (but might not be) corrected or improved in opera.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 04, 2010, 02:00:53 PM
Kicks are nice  ;D

IE8 still showing gif... - in both modes... Same with opera, - no changes there.

PS: this time I double checked everything :D


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 04, 2010, 06:53:13 PM
To get to the bottom of this I decided to simply install Opera.. A few tweaks later, and Opera now displays the edit panel properly. As a side note, after this brief encounter I think I'll be using opera more often. It's not bad at all.

IE should be showing png images on anything newer than v6 (IE 5 and 6 both return "4" to version checks, I make no attempt to explain MS logic on that one.. lol).  To help track this issue, I have added the detected browser and version strings to the data table..  if you don't see that info there, try ctrl+f5.. if it returns info, please post the line here so I can see what my script thinks you are using (I can't install anything higher than IE6 on my old win2000 machine)

[edit: newest uploaded copy is v0.3.2.a ]


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 04, 2010, 07:32:28 PM
Yep, Opera now works perfect  ;D

IE... (I am not a fan of IE either...) shows :

Browser: Microsoft Internet Explorer
Browser Version: 4

And that is in both mods (Compatibility and Regular)

Cheers

PS: I did see the browser info line, and tried ctrl+f5 does it just refreshes the browser??


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 04, 2010, 07:42:42 PM
it does refresh, yes, with full cache delete.. sometimes the refresh button itself doesn't reload scripts or css..

ty for the reply, I scrapped the version detection and instead checked for the availability of xmlhttprequest command, which isn't available to v5 or 6.. should be using png this time (if not, it's official that IE dislikes me as much as I dislike it... lol)


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 04, 2010, 08:01:49 PM
It works now images are png... But something is still not correct...

How do you make a snapshot of the screen on PC? (I dont have pc keyboard, I am using MacBook to run windows)


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 04, 2010, 08:06:28 PM
searching found this:

No new downloads or remappings needed. Use the On-Screen Keyboard (All Programs->Accessories->Accessibility:) Hold down the shift key on the "regular" keyboard and press the Print Screen (psc) on the On-Screen Keybord. Works for me.


------
or
------
   
This Is The Right Way:

Cmd (apple) + Shift +3 :
Print All Your Screen To A File Which Will Be Saved On Your Desktop

Cmd(apple) + Shift + 4 :
You Can Drag A Window To Save It To A Jpg File On Your Desktop
Or Press Space To Select A Working Window To Be Printscreened

Hope This Help


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 04, 2010, 08:26:58 PM
Ok, you will be laughing, and I do feel stupid, but none of it worked, and I did find the onscreen keyboard, but there is no print screen key...

Anyway I made a photo with my phone, it is not that good quality-wice, but you can see what I am about to explain...

Only on IE:

When you add an object (any object - drum of cymbal) the image is round with nice smooth corners, but as soon as you will touch it with the mouse the image corners become... LIKE it is a GIF again... - They are all pixelated.

Note the big cymbal in the corner is untouched, the rest of the objects were moved on the stage...

Look closer at the corners of all the images and you will see the difference.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 04, 2010, 08:34:34 PM
ewwwww....   have I mentioned that I hate IE?   lol

This shouldn't be a big problem since this is just the setup engine.. once saved and redisplayed in the (unwritten) viewer the images will be static and hence clean-edged.  I'm going to guess this is a quirk in the library I'm using for making the images draggable, and hence is rather trivial in the grand scheme of things.  At some point I might go mining for the glitch, but for now it's pretty low priority..

question - does the alpha channel black out like that if you move them using the position buttons only?


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 04, 2010, 08:40:06 PM
Ok, give me a min, I have to restart in PC to try that...


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 04, 2010, 08:46:51 PM
Yes it does work well if moved from the editors buttons - if you dont touch the actual image on the stage, and move the images only using the editors buttons, the images do stay smooth  :)


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 04, 2010, 08:51:03 PM
interesting... I just got someone else to try it with dragging, and it worked fine for them. This might be a compatibility issue with wintendo running on the mac platform..


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 04, 2010, 08:58:27 PM
Maybe... Did they try it on ie8/xp??


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 04, 2010, 09:03:09 PM
ie8/vista actually.. I would still like to get another confirmation from someone here though, preferably someone with FF or opera installed to compare results between the browsers

[edit to add:]

minor update, v0.3.3.1a - corrects a numbering glitch introduced when the throne methods were updated (numbers on items and numbers in list did not match).

Throne now obeys z-index.

Base coding written for renumbering items on stage when the list order is changed, but not yet implemented. - done.

This also makes it possible to move the number itself on the image it belongs to so that it doesn't get buried under other items. I hope to have these changes working in the next build. I'm not going to worry about scaling the bass drums just yet, I'll get the pedals happening before I get into the kick dimensioning matter.

It's coming along nice tho, it's getting big but still very fast. None of the delays/lag seen in the flash alternatives...


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 06, 2010, 11:20:32 PM
version 0.3.4a
Refinements to positioning in the editor, including the ability to reposition the number relative to the image it belongs to. Future updates to image and number positioning should include a "move by" field instead of the default 1px.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 07, 2010, 04:57:23 AM
Very cool!!


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: KenSanders on March 07, 2010, 07:21:29 AM
More kudos guys.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 07, 2010, 03:55:24 PM
A noticed glitch when using IE6 (and probably IE5).. the number vanishes when moved beyond the image border (which is transparent and square). I don't know if IE7 or 8 has this problem.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 07, 2010, 04:05:47 PM
Confirmed the number disappears in both mods on IE8/xp...


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 07, 2010, 04:07:48 PM
thanks Pasha, if it were just a legacy issue I might ignore it for a while but since it affects current supported versions it is a 'must fix'.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 07, 2010, 07:14:18 PM
It should be fixed now..  and, as an added bonus, the number can be moved by simply dragging it (fine position controls work too)..


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 07, 2010, 07:39:08 PM
http://cyaorocks.com/dsa/

[just wanted to have the link on this page :)]

Yep it does work great! - Love the fact that you can just drag the number to a preferred place!!!

It does work good in both modes in IE, but there is 1 small glitch...

Try this:

Open a new empty stage.
Add one cymbal and move it to the center of the stage.
Open the editor and using the controls move the number to a new location.
Now drag the cymbal to a new position on a stage.

The number will snap back to the position it was on the cymbal prior you have changed it via the editor.

PS: From what I see it is not a browser issue... as the behavior is the same on all browsers.

PPS: the strange thing is that it works fine if the number is moved via the mouse drag...



Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 07, 2010, 07:53:08 PM
Good find, Pasha.. your ability to find bugs is a huge asset to this project!

number snap-back fixed. :-)


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 07, 2010, 08:23:01 PM
Yeah Right  :D

I think it is the opposite way around!

I think that your ability to fix them as fast as you can, is a MUCH bigger asset to the project!


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 07, 2010, 10:39:30 PM
Version 0.3.5a - this one returns the actual data string(s) that will be saved to the server.. there will be minor revisions (eg the addition of pedals and cleaning up the GUI), but this is pretty much the last major revision of the client side script before Version 1.0 Beta.

Ergo, we need to start thinking about the server side program which will save and redisplay from saved data. The only difficulties I see relate to authentication, we will want it to use the dsa cookie for that and, alas, my experience in that area = null. Also, my PHP experience is minimal, I work mostly with PERL.

Flat file is easier for me, done that lots of times, SQL will take me longer since I have never actually used it for my own apps... If we use SQL we will have to build the tables to store the data displayed in the textarea box on the test page, and again that is completely out of my experience (I'm a hobby-coder, completely self-taught.. lol). So for this part I will have to research the SMF system to see how the api works. Viewing setups doesn't need auth, since they will just  be basic pages with fancy css (or maybe XML), but saving and updating existing setups will obviously require member auth.

I'm open to any and all suggestions here..


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 07, 2010, 11:12:35 PM
Authentication is not a problem for me, and I would not recommend using SMF cookie for that because it is constructed in a very weird way... something similar to: SHA1(SHA1 username + (SHA1 password + salt)+salt+userlevel) or something similar...

We can do it much easier using the main DSA cookies.

MYSQL is also not a problem for me, I would need to see the flat DB file to create the needed table structure.

Pearl can access mysql by itself so I guess I am missing where did you plan for PHP to come in...

I mean the script can just read the strings from MYSQL instead of flatfile on its own. - Or am I missing something??


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 09, 2010, 05:02:29 PM
The script now has a save button which as of yet does not actually save..  but it does send the values for the design to the server where they are used by another page to redisplay the kit as originally designed.

I'll add pedals and make it easier to add other things (like top-view gongs and such), while Pasha works on the part that sticks the data into the database..

This thing is almost ready to go.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 09, 2010, 06:32:34 PM
Well it actually does save already...

PS: Reno I have changed the "-" value back to line break, as we discussed before, but that does not solve the problem...

Script breaks if user inputs a line break or | in description...

I think we should change the data-separators to a longer preset values something like: 157_tbs instead of | and something similar for line breaks...

I dont have any other ideas how to workaround this issue...


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 09, 2010, 07:09:57 PM
You bring up a very good point, I was thinking about that earlier.. the script that builds description has to be adjusted to replace line feeds with html breaks if the user's intent is to be respected.. that will resolve that issue, ensuring false delimiters cannot exist (I need to parse description to replace or escape pipes too, as well as filter out arbitrary code that might be entered like links and such).


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 09, 2010, 07:14:29 PM
Yep just keep me in on the changes so that I would be able to reflect them in the save script.  ;)


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 09, 2010, 08:26:13 PM
No doubt, last thing we need is to clobber each other's work.. lol


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: KenSanders on March 10, 2010, 09:32:03 AM
You guys are amazing.  I am excited about the debute of the results.

I eagerly wait with total antici.....................







pation.  ;)


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on March 11, 2010, 08:55:30 PM
Just a small update here...

Actually we had a HUGE progress with the forthcoming Drum Setup Application!

What is done:

Added the ability to save setups.
Ability to create unlimited amount of setups per user.
Ability to mark 1 setup as "Top" or "Main" setup.
Ability to name/rename setups to what ever desired.
Created Drum Setups List (user edit section) from where users will be able to go to edit screen for each setup.


Users will have 2 pages: 1 where they create/edit setups users will have to be logged-in to get to this page, and another one will be used to display users drum setups.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on March 11, 2010, 09:19:06 PM
to add to Pasha's post -
The sample linked in this thread is, for all intents and purposes, discontinued at the point where it is able to pass basic info from one page to the next and is not being updated.

Development has progressed to testing on DSA servers with full database support, and site integration is the main focus right now.

You guys are gonna love this, it has already shot far beyond my expectations and hasn't even hit beta yet. There is nothing like it elsewhere on the web, this thing is slick. I, personally, cant wait for it to open.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Tomm on March 14, 2010, 05:52:52 PM
Excellent!  PASHA and Reno deserve some major recognition and gratitude in developing this new application.  Let's make sure their efforts are appreciated and used.  Thanks fellows...Tomm


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on April 03, 2010, 11:50:56 AM
Dev and beta are in final stages, release is imminent..
Watch for it!


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: PASHA on April 14, 2010, 02:21:36 AM
Just a short note to all users that the Drum Kit Setup application is out, and everyone is welcome to create one... Or as many as you desire!

All kudos for this amazing application goes to Reno!

Create Your Drum Setup by following to Drum Setup List (http://www.drumsoloartist.com/drumsetup/drum_setup_list.php) and clicking Create Drum Setup link.

PS: users who had their drum setups done on the legacy version can still get to their legacy drum setups by following:

http://www.drumsoloartist.com/wiki/setup/USERNAME - obviously replacing USERNAME with your Drum Solo Artist username.

PPS: we also would like to thank those who participated during the BETA testing and helped us make this application better by creating a few setups and by doing that, showed us all the down sides that needed to be fixed.

Cheers


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on April 14, 2010, 02:43:44 AM
You are too kind - But seriously it was a joint effort, I didn't even come close to doing this all by myself.. Kudos to PASHA too.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: KenSanders on April 14, 2010, 03:52:51 PM
This is one seriously cool app.  Kudos to PASHA ands RENO.  You guys rock.


Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: Reno on April 14, 2010, 06:08:07 PM
Thanks, Ken


A few notes about using the thing:

- When you drag a drum, the number drags with it. But you can also drag the numbers to arrange them, independent of the drum it belongs to.

- All items (and/or their numbers) can be fine-positioned by clicking 'Fine-Tune' in editor. Moving objects this way does not disturb their stack order.

- Clicking an item on the stage brings it to the 'top'.. The z-index buttons can be used to move items up or down, so if you find yourself with a kick on top of the toms you can push it back down where it belongs. You can click an item or number on stage, or in the list to select that item. Clicking the number or the list line does not bring the item to the top.

- Bass drums and pedals are rotatable when selected. Rotation buttons appear in the 'editor' area between the stage and the list.

- the buttons on the left side of the editor move the item up and down in the list, changing the number accordingly.



Title: Re: Drum Setup Application Development
Post by: KenSanders on April 14, 2010, 11:58:53 PM
Hey Reno

Thanks from me and, I'm sure....from other readers..... for those very helpful "user tips".

I've posted my set-up and had lots of fun doing it.

I know everyone is going to really enjoy this new app.